On 2020-07-25 12:17:53, user John H Abeles wrote:
Hydroxychloroquine ( HCQ ) and Covid19
The negative observational and controlled clinical studies to date refer mainly to using hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) in serious, later stage, hospitalised Covid19 patients
In both the Solidarity/WHO study and the Recovery/UK study extremely high, even massive doses ( up to 6 times that recommended for early CoVid19 patients!) were used for unknown reasons - since the half-life of HCQ is around 21-30 days these daily massive doses could have caused very high blood levels and likely were fatal in some instances - so HCQ group deaths could have been caused by such high dose regimes, so probably skewed the results ..
Also this is likely the wrong group of patients to treat with maximum effect, in the first place — early Covid19 is the best arena for HCQ treatment in combination with zinc and either azithromycin or doxycycline...
It must be stated that no known oral antiviral for outpatients works maximally unless given quite early in disease eg oseltamivir/Tamiflu influenza; valacyclovir/Valtrex in herpes
Even iV remdesivir - a potent SARS-CoV-2 antiviral - didn’t achieve hoped for results in hospitalised patients
Later stage Covid19 patients are mostly suffering from the effects of hyperinflammation ( cytokine storm) and when viral titres are well beyond their peaks. Hyperinflammation can cause myocarditis which can certainly predispose to further cardiac toxicity.
[There are interesting thoughts that the hospitalised patients with cytokine storm / hyperinflammation in reality have a form of ADE ( antibody dependent enhancement of disease ) ie a hyperimmune reaction to a second SARS-CoV-2infection or as a result of a SARS-CoV-2 infection after a previous infection with a closely related virus]
HCQ was also used in the negative studies without added zinc which could be a design for failure, as one of the main, but certainly not only, antiviral actions of HCQ is as a zinc ionophore ie it gets zinc to enter cells much more easily where it can exert its added and established antiviral actions
HCQ is a known antiinflammatory and this action may be of some use in the hyperinflammation stage in hospitalised patients, but other more potent immunosuppressive ( and a few candidates that are nonimmusuppresive immunotherapies) could be more demonstrative in this regard.
Despite this there are some data to suggest benefit of HCQ even in hospitalised patients
For early Covid19 the usually prescribed course is for 5 to 7 days of around 400 mg daily HCQ with 100-200 mg zinc which would not invoke the long term side effects mentioned so often - and very few toxicities are reported even in long term therapy for autoimmune disorders. Any short-term arrhythmia concerns can be allayed by making sure of normal potassium blood levels
In the several thousands of outpatient Covid19 case reports published up to now , when used in early disease, there have been few if any major side effects noted.
(But in later stage, serious hospitalised patients many other drugs are also used, bringing into question the possibility of toxic interactions with HCQ. Also organ damage including myocarditis -heart inflammation-could be a particular predisposing factor in hospitalised patient toxicity predisposition to HCQ )
HCQ is a cheap, easily made generically available drug - and main manufacturers, like Novartis and Teva have donated billions of doses worldwide since the event of Covid19, so shortages, as some fear, for those taking it for malaria ( preventions or treatment) or for autoimmune diseases, like lupus or rheumatoid arthritis etc are highly unlikely
Here below are some pertinent positive references for further reading on the question of HCQ plus zinc plus either doxycycline ( my preferred choice because it isn’t associated with further small cardiac risk) or azithromycin
Note : Most of the successful reports of the use of HCQ plus zinc etc are in early stage, outpatients and not in late stage, hospitalised patients
The first link is a large data base (more than 50 studies ) on HCQ in Covid19 treatment
The second reference is an important review from a Yale University professor ...
The third and fourth are on a recent, large, well conducted observational study from Henry Ford Hospital ...
The fifth is an important outpatient study ...
https://c19study.com/
https://academic.oup.com/aj...
https://www.ijidonline.com/...
https://www.henryford.com/n...
https://www.preprints.org/m...
https://www.ijidonline.com/...
https://www.preprints.org/m...
https://aapsonline.org/hcq-...
https://www.medrxiv.org/con...
https://www.preprints.org/m...
https://www.evms.edu/media/...
https://link.springer.com/a...
https://pjmedia.com/news-an...
https://www.medrxiv.org/con...
https://www.medrxiv.org/con...
https://www.middleeasteye.n...
http://www.ijmr.org.in/prep...
https://aapsonline.org/hydr...<br />
decide/
https://www.indiatoday.in/i...
https://www.medrxiv.org/con...